Jesus warned that on Judgment Day, He would tell many that He "never knew them” because, although they performed religious actions in His name, they were harboring iniquity in their hearts. In today’s Timeless Truths, we’ll discuss why repentance and intimacy with Christ will prepare us to stand before God.

Host: Counselor Bill Lucas has joined Kathy Gallagher and I in the studio today. Bill, it's good to see you. Thanks for coming in.

Bill: Thank you for having me.

Host: We want to talk today about the lifestyle and attitude of repentance. We're going to begin by taking a look at three types of individuals described in Scripture that do not reflect an attitude of repentance. Those types are false teachers, those who have never repented, and the self-righteous. Let's start with false teachers. How do we recognize them and how do we recognize that they in fact are not walking in a life of repentance?

Bill: Well, Jesus talks about this in Matthew. “Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits. Grapes are not gathered from thorn bushes nor figs from thistles, are they? So every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot produce bad fruit, nor can a bad tree produce good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. So then, you will know them by their fruits. Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter.” (Matthew 7:15-21, NASB 1995) Just looking at this Scripture, it wakes me up to see that it's not about what you're doing so much on the outward, but it is an inward call. The inside is very important, and that's what I believe Jesus is trying to wake us up to.

Kathy: Yea, they are teachers, and they are in front of a crowd of people. They're leading people. But the thing that Jesus sees is what's going on in the inside. The motivation of the heart. That's what He's looking at.

Host: So, these false teachers are in the Church and they look like other believers in a lot of ways?

Bill: Correct. The false prophet is one who is mainly being governed by their own evil lust. The Bible talks a little bit about this in Romans. It says that they are like slaves of their own appetites and they deceive unsuspecting people.

Host: What does Scripture indicate motivates false teachers?

Bill: Well, anyone that you would think of that's promoting their own agenda. They're doing it for a profit or it's a trade of theirs to a degree. They're trying to promote their own kingdom. They're building a kingdom of their own rather than building up the Kingdom of God.

Host: Sounds like a politician giving the people what their itching ears want to hear. They’ll say whatever will make the people happy to get elected.

Bill: Interestingly yes, there are those similarities.

Host: Well, now let's talk about those who have never truly repented. I know that there are a lot of individuals in the church who surround themselves with a cloak of Christianity. They may go to church. They may listen to Christian radio programs. They may read Christian books. But the Bible does speak very clearly about who will enter the Kingdom of Heaven, and it's not describing those who are just doing these outward things.

Bill: That's right. Of course, the Bible is very clear about who does get to come into Heaven, and that is repeatedly said to be the one that does the will of the Father. And Romans 12:1-2 is very clear to me. It says, “Therefore I urge you, brethren, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living and holy sacrifice, acceptable to God, which is your spiritual service of worship. And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, so that you may prove what the will of God is, that which is good and acceptable and perfect.” (Romans 12:1-2, NASB 1995)
       And I just look at the idea of repentance. When you are convicted by the Holy Spirit, there is a change that occurs in you. It must happen and it's not something that is adaptable with the world system. You have to begin to go in a completely different direction from where the world system is leading you.

Host: But on the other hand, Jesus talks about those that do not appear to have adapted to the world system, but in fact seem on the outside to have adapted to the religious system. And He talks about those in that camp that surely will end up in hell. Talk to us a little bit about Jesus's admonition about that.

Bill: Yes, outwardly there is an element of Christianity in those people Jesus is talking about, but He is looking at their heart. And for those that have never truly repented, there's an element of wickedness remaining in their heart. 2 Timothy, 2:19 says, “Let everyone who names the name of Christ depart from iniquity.” (2 Timothy 2:19, NKJV) Again, in Psalm 5:5, “The boastful shall not stand in Your sight; You hate all workers of iniquity.” (Psalm 5:5, NKJV) And I believe that the people that don't truly repent have iniquity in their heart. Jesus said that he will tell those that prophesied in His name, cast out demons and performed miracles, “I never knew you, depart from me you workers of iniquity.” So, iniquity is still dwelling in their heart that they've never truly repented of.

Kathy: These people that Jesus was speaking of, they were in the Church. They were casting out demons. They were doing many mighty works. And yet Jesus said, “Depart from me, you workers of iniquity. I never knew you.” That's a scary thing, because I think that there are a lot of people doing a lot of churchy stuff who do not know Jesus Christ and have never been born from above. They've joined the church, they've acclimated to the system, but there's a difference between joining the Church and being born into the Church. And I think we see now in our day, a lot of people that are doing a lot of outward things, but there is no real union with Christ.

Host: And there's no real fruit of repentance in their life.

Kathy: Yes. There's no fruit. And outward works don’t equal fruit. That's not what fruit is. Fruit is what is coming out of your life. It's born of the Holy Spirit. It's your life spilling over into the lives of other people and people are coming into the Kingdom as a result of that fruit in your life.

Host: Okay, well we've talked about the false teacher. We've talked about those who have never truly repented. What about the self-righteous? Jesus talked to the Pharisees about self-righteousness.

Bill: Jesus said that your righteousness must surpass that of the Scribes and Pharisees, or you will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Righteousness is the lack of iniquity. And a repentant heart is one that has departed from iniquity. The truly repentant person, and the one that is not a self-righteous person, is low in heart and humble and willing to acknowledge their lack. They're willing to see their need for God.

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Kathy: It’s spiritual poverty, which is what the Pharisees didn't have. Their righteousness was outward, and that's what the self-righteous do. They prop themselves up on the things that they do, their outward works and the way they even look. If they can appear righteous to people, then they consider that Christianity. But Jesus said it goes way beyond that. It's the heart that God is looking at. And when He said that your righteousness must surpass that outward ability to look like a Christian, He was highlighting that it's a heart issue.

Bill: Right. The Pharisees were law-keepers. But Jesus came into the world and started representing the idea of an inward life. It's an element of faith that is being missed in our churches today that people need to just acknowledge their need for God in faith and start looking not so much at the outward but start looking at the true motives of their own heart. It’s very real to me that my character is established when I'm all alone, or when no one else is around and that tells me something.

Host: Amen. Let's end this discussion by talking about what the outcome of a lifestyle of repentance is and kind of break it into the negative and the positive. What are some of the negative things from a human perspective that we might experience if we're walking out this kind of life?

Bill: The word that comes to mind is persecuted. You'll be persecuted for being extreme or overzealous. When it comes to following hard after Jesus, one thing I've learned is that it's hard. Jesus throughout the New Testament seemed to make it very clear that there is going to be affliction, there is going to be persecution and there are going to be tough times for those who choose to live out a righteous life. But Jesus says to endure to the end.
       I've got to keep looking at the fact that Jesus, when He talks about true Christianity and denial of self, says that He's going to give us what we need as long as we endure to the end. It doesn't always feel good. It doesn't always seem to be the most popular thing to be doing. But I know one thing, I'm not going to quit. And God is getting the glory from my life as long as I don't quit this walk of righteousness.

Host: Well, and that of course is part of what we want to end up on here and that is that there is a tremendous reward. There is a positive side to living this kind of lifestyle.

Bill: Jesus says in Matthew 5:12, “Rejoice and be glad, for your reward in Heaven is great.” (Matthew 5:12a, NASB 1995) And I know that there is a peace and joy that reaches beyond the tentacles of this present world.

Host: Yes, and there is great joy in that.

In the 4th message of our Unveiling Yahweh series, we will be looking at the Mercy of God.

This week, Dustin Renz turns to the Old Testament to look at the mercy at work during a pivotal time in the prophet Elijah’s life. We hope this unique look at a familiar biblical account brings you a fresh sight of how God loves to pour out mercy into our lives.

A God-filled marriage does not happen by accident. It is built on the foundation of ongoing repentance toward God and a spirit of humility toward each other. In Ep. 06 of our series, "On the Same Team," we'll be talking with PLM graduates Greg and Paloma about why it's been so important for both of them to remain aware of their own sin and their own great need for God.

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In the 3rd message of our Unveiling Yahweh series, we will be looking at the Greatness of God.

In this message, Steve Gallagher encourages us to seek a deeper revelation of God’s greatness. Seeing more of His grandeur should impact our daily lives and cause us to walk more closely to Him.

It's an amazing thing when the person who sees our sins and flaws most clearly is also completely devoted to seeing us walk in victory. In Ep. 05 of our series, "On the Same Team," we'll talk with PLM graduates Bob and Lori about one of the big focuses in their marriage: building each other up in love.

In the 2nd message of our Unveiling Yahweh series, we will be looking at the Patience of God.

Throughout history God has displayed His patience towards mankind again and again. When a person or a nation sins, He does not always display His judgment immediately. Instead, He often holds back for a time. And sometimes that can be decades or even centuries. Why does He wait? What is the reason for such extravagant patience?

Today in our latest sermon series, Unveiling Yahweh, Luke Imperato unpacks God’s patience and reveals its intended purpose for us.

If we approach Scripture or life's challenges through human logic, our perspective will be devoid of spiritual wisdom. In this "Timeless Truths" segment, Steve Gallagher urges us to stop relying on our own understanding and instead turn to the Lord, so that He can impart the mind of Christ to us.

Host: Steve Gallagher has joined me in the studio today. Steve, we want to talk today about the wisdom of “kosmos.” You discussed this at some length in your book, “Intoxicated with Babylon.” And in that chapter where you discussed the subject, you talked about the Western mind and how it has permeated so much of Christianity in America today. What did you mean by the Western mind?

Steve: Well, Paul differentiates in the book of 1 Corinthians between the Jewish mindset and the Greek mindset. The Jewish mindset tied up in a nationalistic fervor regarding the Messiah and the temple and other elements of their cultural heritage. But the Greeks had a different way of approaching life, and it was through what they would call wisdom which was their Greek term “sofía.” Athens was the cultural center of Greek philosophy and their approach to looking at spirituality came through the processes of different theories that they would spin as they sat around and discussed things. So, to put it in a nutshell, the Western mind is simply a way to describe people who approach the Word of God and life’s problems through human logic rather than through what God has accomplished in their heart.

Host: Well, God did give us a mind, so what's wrong with approaching life’s issues using the natural reasoning mind?

Steve: We have to remember that Paul said, “The mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so.” (Romans 8:7, NASB) There is a very profound truth in that statement. We have a nature that is fallen because of our sin disposition. Left to ourselves our minds are going to revolve around self and selfishness. It will revolve around the way we want things to be and it will revolve around pride. So, when we're approaching spiritual matters, for us to just depend upon the logic of the human mind is dangerous because it's founded upon a faulty foundation.
         The only difference between a discerning spirit and a critical spirit is brokenness. Both use the human mind to look at a person’s faults and weaknesses and struggles, but an unbroken person looks at those faults through a self-righteous perspective. A person who has undergone the processes of God's discipline and knows what it means to be broken, who has gone through Calvary and has had his own sin issues dealt with, that person is going to look at another person's faults and struggles with a completely different mindset. It's going to be the mind of Christ that he is going to look at those problems through. And therein lies the difference between godly discipleship and most of the therapy that is being utilized under the guise of Christian Psychology in the United States today.

Host: Well, you jumped right to the next subject. We do also want to talk about psychology, especially psychotherapy in the church today. Many people think about psychology with some form of the following logical trail of thought: if I break my finger, I go to the doctor. If my car is not working, I take it to the mechanic. So, if my mind is broken, why not go to the psychologist who is supposed to be the expert in the mind? What are your thoughts on that?

Steve: Well, the mind isn't the problem, the heart is the problem. And until you get the heart straightened out, you can't straighten out the mind. The problem is that we all have faulty minds. The psychologist has a faulty mind. And if that psychologist hasn't truly been to the cross and gone through a repentance process himself, then he's in no condition spiritually to lead someone else to that place.
       You cannot lead another person spiritually any further than you've gone yourself. You can spend 20 years studying all the different nuances of psychology and the different theories and therapies. You can become the world's leading expert on all those things, but if you haven't surrendered at the cross and you don't know what it's like to have the mind of Christ, you're not going to have the ability to help Christians live a victorious Christian life.

Host: And that really is the goal. The goal isn't for a person to feel better; the goal is to be victorious in their walk with Christ.

Steve: The only way a person's really going to have fulfillment in life is to find it in Christ. The problem is that a lot of people don't want to go to the cross and surrender to the Lord, because they want to stay in control of their lives. They don't want to give up anything. They want to fit their lives around their worldly pursuits. And the truth is that for the most part, psychology teaches a form of life that says you don't have to go to the cross and surrender anything. It's an alternative to going to the cross, really.

Host: In fact, you've said it is a false substitute for going to the cross or it is a line of thought that loves self as opposed to denying self.

Steve: Yeah. And so, if you don't want to deny self and you don't even want to go in that direction, psychology is a great option for you.

Host: And there is such a tremendous movement to accept that psychologized view in the church and very often we see this in the form of what we call “integrationism.” This is the perspective that we ought to integrate this worldly philosophy with the Word of God. What is the problem with that?

Steve: Well, the problem is that the two are completely conflicting in what they're teaching. You're either going to the cross with your life, with your teachings, with what you are sharing with others, or you're going away from the cross and finding some way to comfort people in their sin. That's really the difference. You can't combine those two opposing philosophies. It's impossible.

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Host: They really are oil and water. I know that you go into this at great length in the rest of your book, “Intoxicated with Babylon,” but what is it about God's people today that opens us up to the acceptance of these kinds of ideas?

Steve: Well, when you are in large part lending your mind to the voice of the world through television, through the internet, through school and worldly friends or coworkers, when your life is being much more influenced by the spirit of the world than it is by the spirit of Jesus Christ, you are just simply going to be much more vulnerable to their solutions, their ideas and their answers. You are just going to be very open to those kinds of teachings.

Host: You've been helping men and women in sexual sin for over 20 years now. And despite the fact that some look at Christianity and look at the Word of God as being too simple to handle what they call the deep emotional problems of man, it's your experience that there is a true power in Christ to overcome those problems.

Steve: Yes. And I had enormous emotional problems myself. But I have found this to be true not only in my own life, but in the lives of many that I've dealt with over the years, that when Jesus Christ has his rightful place in a person's life; when a person has really gotten a good sight of the Lord; when a person is really connected with the Lord through a strong devotional life; when a person has gone to the cross, and so on, those problems that may have seemed like a mountain before quickly become nothing more than a mole hill. It's just true that when God is big, our problems become small. But one of the greatest challenges that we have dealing with people who are struggling is that all the attractions and pleasures of the world have been huge and God has been tiny in their perspective. So, of course their problems are going to be huge as well. And our job at Pure Life Ministries is to turn that equation around and make God very big in their minds and hearts. And when we are able to help a person accomplish gain that perspective, then their problems are going to be very manageable.

Host: Amen. Well, Steve, I hope that will be an encouragement to those who may be listening. To those who may have bounced back and forth from all kinds of worldly wisdom looking for an answer to know that there is an answer for them. There is hope for them and it is found at the cross in Christ.

Steve: Absolutely.

Host: Amen.

When Nolan and Kendra Godfrey entered our counseling programs, they were ready to rid their marriage of sexual sin forever. But as they received biblical counseling, they realized that sexual sin was only a small part of their problem. What was far more destructive to both of them was their love of what the world offered. In Ep. 04 of "On the Same Team," we'll talk about why every Christian couple must vigilantly guard their hearts and minds from the spirit of this world.

In the 1st message of our Unveiling Yahweh series, we will be looking at what it means to know God.

Eternal life comes from an intimate relationship with the Lord. But since The Fall, mankind has lost that intimacy and developed wrong views of God and His character. This has caused a host of pain, suffering and sin, as we see all around us each day. The solution each of us needs to find peace and freedom is to return to a true, intimate knowledge of God.

Join us for our new sermon series, "Unveiling Yahweh", as we seek to magnify the true beauty and wonder of God’s nature.

If both spouses truly want to be united and devoted to one another, how do they walk out that desire? What specific things should they be doing (and NOT doing)? In Ep. 03 of "On the Same Team," Jeff and Rose Colón share some of their extensive counseling experience with us as they talk about the biggest challenges that couples seeking restoration will have to navigate.

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Check out the first video in our podcast series going through Jeff and Rose Colón’s book: God is Willing and Able to Transform ANY Marriage | Ashes to Beauty

If you're interested in Jeff and Rose Colón’s book, purchase it here: From Ashes to Beauty

The love of Christ for us is one of the most powerful motivations we have for leading a holy life. Yet love, for many Christians, has been shaped by our culture and is often based on superficial characteristics or fleeting feelings. That kind of love can quickly dissolve and change. So to experience a love for Christ that will truly control our actions, we must understand what Christ’s love for us truly means, and the kind of effect it should have in our lives.

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In Ep. 02 of our series, "On the Same Team," we continue our conversation with Pure Life founders Steve and Kathy Gallagher. Like so many couples, Steve and Kathy’s marriage had been utterly shattered by pride, selfishness and infidelity. But when they were both broken over their own sin, something beautiful began to happen. They became unified and devoted in a way they never had before.