Fighting Against Pride: A Wife's Struggle

In this interview, Kathy Gallagher draws on her own journey with the Lord and years of counseling, to help identify forms of pride that betrayed and hurting wives often struggle with.

Host: Kathy last week we talked with one of our counselors about the way that a selfish lifestyle and a proud heart go hand in hand with sexual sin. I'm sure that you've experienced firsthand when your husband Steve was in sexual sin, that there was a very proud heart and a very selfish lifestyle that was giving birth to this sexual sin. Today we want to look at things from a wife's perspective.   We've found that pride and selfishness are also major issues for the wives that we counsel.  I'm sure you've experienced this yourself and seen it in the lives of the many wives you've counseled throughout the years. To start off, could you talk about some of the ways that selfishness and pride present themselves in wives that you've counseled?

Kathy: Yeah, I would really like to start off with my own testimony because we all respond in different ways.  I think many people will understand where I'm coming from with this. Because of Steve's sexual sin, I eventually began to see how the Lord was using that to expose what was in me.  He was using Steve's sin to reveal to me what was in my own heart. And I was mostly looking for relief from the pain and a way out of the mess. I was not looking at me; I was looking at him, and what he was doing to me. I fell prey to the whole victim thing, and in a sense I was a victim.  However, the decisions that I was making, especially in the early days, were very selfish and very sinful. I naturally justified. What I mean is, in my nature it was easy for me to justify adultery. As in "he did this, and now I'm justified with what I do"? Yes, I was justifying adultery.  I was justifying anger and bitterness.  I was self-righteous.

My attitude was: "look at what he's doing to me!"  And that phrase, "look at what he's doing to me" is the gateway to justifying sinful attitudes and sinful behaviors. Those natural human responses are what God was after in me.  He was going after my own prideful and arrogant responses to what was being done to me. I know that sounds hard, especially for women who are really hurting right now. They don't see it that way. I didn't see it that way, for sure.  It took the Lord years to convince me and to show me what was coming out of my mouth, out of my heart and out of my life. I was standing outside of the scriptures.  In my own mind, my title as wife put me in a different category. I don't think anybody thinks this through, it's just the response that comes out: "I am a wife who's been betrayed by my husband." So my feelings and my pain from what he was doing dictated my responses. I assumed that scriptures like first Corinthians thirteen didn't really apply to me; at least in my marriage they didn't apply to me. "Blessed are the meek," I was anything but meek or humble. I wasn't looking for that path. I think that's where a lot of women find themselves at. They are lost in a sea of hurt and anger.  And God is going to go after that because He's good. He's a good Father; and a good parent doesn't let their children just go on and on and on in their "bad behavior."

Host: I'm glad that you brought up the role that God plays in our life as Father, because that's something that we often don't see amid trials and difficulties. The other thing that we often don't see is the role that the enemy is playing, and the role that sin is trying to play in our lives.  Because, obviously the feelings of hurt and betrayal are not sinful, and I'm sure that Jesus keenly felt the betrayal of mankind and even from His disciples.  But in that betrayal He never sinned.  We're different, however.  We're corrupted, and pride is relentless in its attempt to overcome us.  It's trying to ensnare us and dominate us in situations like this. Can you talk a little bit about that, so we can come to understand the enemy behind all these things?

Kathy: Sure. This is a powerful tool in the devil's arsenal and he wields it continually. He's always looking for an opportunity to ensnare us through pride. Most of us betrayed wives didn’t even think about pride, you know?  But I've never met a person who did not struggle intensely with the pain of an unfaithful husband. And I have never once felt that it was wrong to experience those feelings. As you said Nate, God Himself experiences the pain and betrayal of his own unfaithful people every day. He lives with it. It's a constant and unending grief in His heart. He also knows what we're going through and He understands it.

However, women still have pride issues in their human nature. I think the biggest pride issue I have seen in women is those who take absolute control over their husband.  They feel the need for constant updates and information.  Their compelled to say, "where were you?"  The feel a need to know, "what did you spend money on?"  Feeling anxious that he's looking at his phone and looking at his computer. They're driven to call him throughout the day.  It's a fear driven pride. There's no other word really to describe it. Because what's behind it is, "I'm protecting myself" and "I'm going to keep myself together," as well as "I'm going to control you."  Her motivating belief towards her husband is: "I'm going to make you do the right thing;" and "I'm going to fix this thing." I have probably dealt with that issue more than anything else.

There are others who try to control it in the way of seeking peace at any cost. I could categorize myself in that because I was willing to do things that were unthinkable to make him do the right thing. I really thought that I could get him to see things my way by going along with his sin.  That was such a horrible, horrible grief to me, and I know it was a grief to God.  But the older I got and the more I've started to really see things from God's perspective.  Perhaps the ugliest thing I saw in myself was that I didn't care enough about Steve to step in and say "no."  From the standpoint of caring for his soul, not in being a control freak, this would have been the loving thing to do to him.  But for too long in those early years I failed to say, "stop, I am not going to live like this." But I would think to myself, "this is not what God has called me to." I didn't care that much about spiritual things. I didn't care that much about my husband. I cared about me, and I was willing to go along with whatever I needed to go along with to keep the peace and make him do the right thing. So the bottom line is that all of what is in us is just selfishness. I hate to say that because I'm talking to women who are hurt. They want to be comforted, and they need to be comforted.  But this isn't the path. The path of pride will always lead you to ruin, and that is what the devil is going for.

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Host: Yeah, the path that seems like it's leading toward wholeness can actually be taking us toward ruin.  Satan is able to create these images and unrealities, and to just keep us coming toward something we desire.  You think it's leading you in a good way, and then it's revealed to not be the case. That's what we've found. That's why we're saying these things. It's because we know where that path of pride and selfishness goes. So we're earnestly telling you: don't go there.

Kathy: You know I'll tell you something Nate. When people continue going and being led down that path they become hardened in their hearts.  You can become callous because the enemy is leading you.  And indeed he is cajoling you, and is wooing you to fight for your rights. He'll say, "defend yourself," "do not put up with this stuff," and "I'm not going to put up with it!" There's something in that attitude that is hardening. I know that path from experience.  But I also know the path of brokenness. I needed the Lord to step in and start exposing me. So that's what He was doing. He was showing me what I was doing wrong.  When I started looking at what the Word of God is actually saying I couldn't get away from my failure to God as a believer. I'm a Christian first and a wife second. There were all these emotions and all these feelings. But God revealed my sin! The sin was just so destructive, and the pride that was in both of us was destroying us both. The enemy was having his way. But then the Lord started leading me down His path of submission. Not to sin, and not to my husband's sin, but to the Lord. It was a long and arduous path, but there's something valuable we gain in the suffering for Jesus, if we will allow the Lord to use it. This doesn't mean we're going to get it all right, and that it'll be rosy, but we'll get a few things right. It's a path of brokenness and humility. It's the path that Jesus himself took and He is our example.

Host: Yes, obviously I'm not a wife and I've never been through this, but from my own testimony I've experienced the entrenched self-righteousness of believing that I am better than anyone else. That prideful belief runs so deep. It takes so many revelations of our sinfulness and the cross, as well as the holiness and the love of God to break us out of that self-righteous belief. To destroy the belief that says I'm good and that I have anything to recommend me to God, that I'm better than other people. It is a hard pill to swallow.  This is coming from a person who's done horrible things. Most wives, I would guess, haven't done that.

Kathy: You know that's not just what Jesus died for.  He didn't just die for sinful behaviors, but for attitudes as well. And the attitude, "I would never do that" is what He's going for.  He's going after that. I'm sure most Christians have probably heard this before, but I'm going to say it again: under the right circumstances, given the opportunity, there isn't much evil you wouldn't do. We're evil, and that is a revelation that every believer needs to come to.  You cannot come to the cross until you understand your black heartedness. Jesus did not come to heal the healthy; He came to heal the sick.  He came to redeem us from every lawless deed. Whether or not we've ever committed sexual sin, or whether or not we were Hitler in our hearts, that doesn't matter. We are fallen. The thing that was a game changer for me was Luke chapter eighteen: the publican and the Pharisee.  These two, the righteous one and the sinner went to the temple. They went to church to pray. The self-righteous Pharisee who thought he was good said "I would never do that!" If you finish that passage, the scripture says he did not go home justified in God's eyes. The tax collector on the other hand wouldn't even look up to God because he was so ashamed, so guilt ridden, so beaten down and fully aware of who and what he was.  For him his sinfulness was real.  And for me it wasn't just sexual sin, I came to the point where I saw myself in that man.  That's who I was. I couldn't even look up to heaven.  And just like him I came to beat my breast and say "God be merciful to me the sinner!" As Jesus said that man went home justified, that is what He did for me.  When I saw that Jesus had hung on that cross for the "good little girl" I had thought I was, God’s amazing love became real to me.

In my book "When His Secret Sin Breaks Your Heart," chapter five is called a level playing field.  That's where I describe what I went through when God used the cross of Calvary to break my heart.  It put me on level ground with Steve. I saw that I had already committed so much sin by that point, and that I was actually a sinner. Until a person wraps their head around this truth, they can't have the compassion, and the understanding and the willingness to go through with another sinner until they've had that real revelation. And calling yourself Christian means nothing. It doesn't mean anything to say "I'm a Christian, I go to church and a prayer meeting on Wednesday." Whatever!  It's what is flowing out of you as a believer in your daily life towards your enemies that matters. At least what we think are our enemies.  

Host: As you were talking I was just thinking about how the enemy paints a picture to lead us into destruction, and he also paints a picture to keep us from life.  The idea of me seeing and finding out just how wrong I am as a person; he's always telling us, through our sinful nature, "don't do it," "That's suffering, misery and pain," and "God would never want that." It's like a barrier keeping us from real life and freedom in God. Because like you said, that publican went home right with God. That's real freedom.

Kathy: It sure is. And you can live with anything and practically anybody when you are that meek. That's what it takes is meekness, and a real humbling of your pride. God is faithful, and He knows how to take us that way. The question is do you want to go that way? And are you going to argue against Him? Because our natural responses are part of the fall, and those are what Jesus came to redeem us from. That sinful and fallen nature in every form it takes.

Host: Ok, so if a wife is going this way, as you've said, the path of brokenness, humbling herself and receiving God’s forgiveness, and her husband is a repenting of His sin, and their relationship, is in that sense restored, there is still a lot of rebuilding and a lot of struggle for both people I'm sure. In the early stages, the self-life still needs a lot of dying.  It's on the cross, but man is it painful. How do you counsel couples to go through this early period without just being totally beaten down with discouragement?

Kathy: It's not easy, and I'm not going to pretend like it is.  It's very difficult. But once both of them are on the path there's so much hope. This is brief but I think it's life-changing If a person will just sit and think it through: quit looking to and at each other. Start there and then learn to say, "I was wrong, would you please forgive me?" You have to quit looking to that person to meet some need inside of you. We have a forced version of marital love in America, and it's probably worldwide. But it's been in America especially. It's a forced version of love that consists of a big wedding, a big house, lots of kids, all my personal needs being met by another person, marital bliss and the happily ever after deal. But true love is the tossing aside of personal happiness as trivial. True love is planting deep in our hearts the interests of another person. It is us meeting their need.  Not insisting that they meet our needs. If people can turn it around if they can start to think in terms of "I'm here for him" and "I'm here for her." As well as "I'm not here for me," "she's not here to satisfy my needs," and "he's not here to satisfy my needs," that selflessness is what makes marriage excellent.

This means a willingness to quit looking to that person to be your all in all. Doing this will eliminate and deal with so many problems! Perhaps just as important is the ability to say, "I was wrong, please forgive me." If you can do that marriage, you will have a very healthy and long marriage together.  You will become affectionate friends. You will have such deep camaraderie, such deep fellowship and intimacy.  Many people are grasping in their own strength. They're trying to do it in their own strength and desire, and they say "I'm going to make it happen!" But that's not the way God laid out for His people, or for any human being. It's through self-sacrifice and it is through selflessness. It's Jesus' life lived out in us and through us.