If genuine Christianity begins by completely relying upon God to save us, then we should never lose that sense of helplessness. That’s one of the secrets to a vibrant walk with God: a lifelong, continual reliance upon the power of the Holy Spirit.

Host: Kathy, we're going to continue our discussions in Andrew Murray’s Book entitled Absolute Surrender, and this chapter is entitled, “Having Begun in the Spirit.” He begins this chapter talking about what the great need of the Church is today. Talk a little bit about what we see in the Church and what he has to say about the need that he sees.

Kathy: I want to open up with this quote and it’s actually sort of a prayer. He says, “Oh, God, our spiritual life is not what it should be!” And then he goes on to talk about how our great need in the body of Christ is to understand our need for the Holy Spirit more than just there being a mental assent to it and that we just really come into the reality that we cannot live the Christian life apart from the Holy Spirit. And I was thinking about a conversation that I had with a pastor and his wife. This pastor has a huge church that is thriving outwardly. That pastor was saying that there's another church down the road and he knows that those people love God. They pray and they have the Holy Spirit, but that church’s congregation is only about two hundred people. And this pastor of the larger church is asking the question, how can that be? He's upset inside, because he knows that something's wrong in his church of thousands and yet, look at the numbers. But the church down the street with 200 people is thriving as far as heaven is concerned.

Host: Yeah, because it is thriving spiritually.

Kathy: Yes, because they're full of the Holy Spirit. But they're not attracting crowds because, to be honest, the majority of people are not interested in that. What the pastor with the thousands in his congregation has is a very seeker-friendly message. So, he has outward success he can point to. But where is the power of the Holy Spirit? And I think that you can use the same kind of analogy in our own lives.

Host: Yeah, the great danger is that we try to do the right thing, but we try to do it in the flesh instead of doing it through the Holy Spirit. And we ask ourselves, “Why do I get so worn out? Why do I get frustrated? Why do we have strivings between each of us as individuals?” And what Andrew Murray brings out in this chapter that really jumped out to me is that when we find ourselves experiencing those things, it's evidence that we're doing things in the flesh, even though we're trying to do the right thing. There are many people of course in the church who have never been converted, so they don't have the Holy Spirit. But there are also a lot of people in the church that have been converted and have the Holy Spirit, but they're not walking in the Spirit.

Kathy: Right. So many of us lose sight of our servant-ness. I know I did when I was in the thick of things here at Pure Life, and it's very difficult to remember that you are supposed to be living and abiding in the power of the Holy Spirit, otherwise the day just kind of overtakes you. Andrew Murray said in this chapter, “Nothing will help you unless you come to understand that you must live every day under the power of the Holy Spirit.” And that is so true. So, the question is, “how do you do that?” That's what a devotional life is. And when I say devotional life, I don't mean necessarily opening your Bible and praying. I’m talking about being devoted to Christ and at the same time realizing your utter dependence on Him.

Host: Yeah one of the things Murray brings out is that, quite frankly, the way that God has always worked in people to accomplish that is by allowing them to fail.

Kathy: Right. I remember the day that I realized I could not serve God in the flesh. It's impossible. I threw my hands up in such frustration and such anguish of soul. I just felt like I was spiritually losing it. But that was actually probably the moment when I started to begin to get it.

Host: And wasn't that the beginning of glorious freedom?

Kathy: It has taken and is taking time, but yeah, I'm starting to really embrace and love the Lord for His immense patience with me. But also, how gentle and how kind He is to reveal Himself to me. I'm a vessel of His mercy. That's all I am and that's all I'm ever going to be. I'm never going to grow up into being this spiritual anything. I have nothing. I am nothing and I can do nothing, and I say it gladly now. And I think that is the freedom that comes from living in the power of the Holy Spirit.

Host: Yeah, Paul said, “I glory in my weaknesses.” Because really, we have no strength in the Lord until we understand our weaknesses. You described how we can get busy in ministry and the day overtakes us and usually we don't realize we've even got out of walking in the power of the Holy Spirit until maybe we run into the end of the track or we realize all of a sudden we're on the wrong track and we’re not where we were set out to go.

Kathy: Yeah, and there's a brick wall there and we wonder, how did that get there?

Host: Yeah, but man, I just want to repeat what you said earlier about how faithful God is to get our attention and say, “Hey, open your eyes and look around and see where you are.” And then what does He say? Does He say, “Well, here's 22 things you've got to do in order to get back to where you're supposed to be on the right track?” No, He says, “You just need to turn and ask for my Holy Spirit and I'll put you back on track.” He is faithful to do that too.

Kathy: Yeah, He so is. The amazing thing is that God is always calling. You have to really listen and when you cultivate that listening ear, you are just waiting before Him. That is very hard for Americans to do.

Host: You bet. We’re doers and producers.

Kathy: Yeah, and where we get off track is we think that doing means more to God than being. He’s not a production miser. He's not looking for you to make something. He wants you to become like Him.

Host: Yeah. And that's what's happening in so many of our churches. They've become producers and doers. That smaller church you mentioned, although I don't know them, if the power of God is there, I will just assume they spend more time sitting at the feet of Jesus. And that's where their power and strength is coming from.

Kathy: That's right. They understand their need and they know they need God's Holy Spirit. They’re not making programs. That's not what we need to be doing. We need to be becoming conformed to the image of Christ.

Host: Yeah. I read an article where they were asking why are the young people leaving the church? Is it because the church isn't cool enough? And of course, we see all the things going on in the church to make it cool for young people, and a young person responded, “We're not leaving the church because the church isn't cool. We're leaving the church because Jesus isn't there.”

Kathy: Yeah. They're not seeing the power of God.

Host: They need something real. They want something real.

Kathy: Yeah. If you're not seeking after a continual filling of His Holy Spirit and His power, you’ll end up defaulting to doing things in the flesh. There's no power there.

Host: There's no spiritual fruit.

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All quotations taken from Absolute Surrender By Andrew Murray, Public Domain